These dicks never stop the insanity.....

[SausageofPower]

You may only see that but that just is not true....nitro finish versus poly....& a "relic" guitar has a reliced finish not "damaged"....& again feels & looks like an old broken-in guitar....but YMMV!!

http://www.jcfonline.com/threads/140...-Bruce-Bennett

^I feel like this is a relevant post. Thanks to Sully for sharing it. Makes perfect sense to me (regarding nitro vs. poly).

[leftykingv2]

Though you'll never see me agreeing the RR1 Tribute is worth it's money
With Gibson, these kind of things are becoming more and more normal

and as for Relic'd guitars: Sorry, No! I'm not stupid enough to pay extra for a beat up guitar
Neither do you guys when you see damage listed on an Ebay Axe, so why for this obvious fraud?

I agree. It's paying new money for a damaged instrument. When you or I drop a guitar the value goes down but when Gibson does it the value goes up! Maybe it's just me but relic or damage looks exactly the same. It's all beat up. There's a guy who lives down the street from me with a left handed Jackson Soloist from the Ontario builds and it's beat to shit. it's maybe a 6 out of 10 on condition. He's been trying to sell it to me for $1500.00 bucks which is about what he paid for it when it was new. Maybe he thinks his Soloist is a relic because it's not worth a penny more than $750.00 bucks. It's all kinds of beat up but it looks just like the Relics Gibson is putting out.

[leftykingv2]

http://www.jcfonline.com/threads/140...-Bruce-Bennett

^I feel like this is a relevant post. Thanks to Sully for sharing it. Makes perfect sense to me (regarding nitro vs. poly).

+1 I read this whole thing a while back and it's a very good article!

[walshula]

Other than one being accidental and the other being on purpose what is the actual difference? Something other than just in the price please.

"damage" & a relicing are two different thangs!!

[BLOOD SPLATTER]

Nitro finish (nitro & poly do not wear the same....waiting for poly to wear will be a LONG time)

finish checking

worn hardware (usually nickel)

& they are not "dropped"....there are plenty of vids showing the relicing process online


But again....YMMV....some folks "get" relics & others do not....not gonna defend relics on a Jackson forum where most players obviously prefer their instruments "minty" !!

[leftykingv2]

Nitro finish (nitro & poly do not wear the same....waiting for poly to wear will be a LONG time)

finish checkingF

worn hardware (usually nickel)

& they are not "dropped"....there are plenty of vids showing the relicing process online


But again....YMMV....some folks "get" relics & others do not....not gonna defend relics on a Jackson forum where most players obviously prefer their instruments "minty" !!

You don't have to defend anything bro. If you like them that's cool with me. They're just not my bag especially with the price they charge for them. Nitro does wear a lot differently and need I say faster than poly. I have a Fender Highway one I bought off a buddy and it's got the nitro on it and the finish is all kinds of worn and I must admit it looks cool the way it's wearing. It's about 6 years old or so and he sold it to me after he had it for about a year. When I got it from him it was in really good shape probably a 9 out of 10. I jam at open mic sometimes and I swear the thing is yellowing prematurely because of the smokers who are there. Also I know they don't drop the guitars they're going to relic I was just being an ass which am very good at by the way.

[Brandenburg]

See I am of the opinion that I want to relic a guitar myself the real way...By playing it! I mean you could drop the money on that guitar and hate the way Duane has worn it in. You know Gibson's not giving anyone a refund on anything! So then you're stuck with a 10K beat up guitar you hate. I'd have to spend some serious time playing a relic guitar before I spent that kind of money on it. But to each their own. I just hate how everything costs so much now. I mean I have money and I am not hurting for anything but to me it seems like everyone has forgotten the value of a dollar. Like I said the only way I drop that kind of money is for a real vintage instrument.

+1 Fukin A.. my sentiments exactly

[Hellbat]

So the concept of these guitars isn't really about how much they can charge for a beat up guitar. ( to a point anyways. )

What these types of guitars are targeted towards is someone who is a superfan of the artist and wants to have a guitar as close as humanly possible to what their hero played. You'd have a higher chance of winning a powerball lottery than getting your hands on one of Randy's guitars. But you can get one built as closely as possible as far as materials, dimensions, and simulated wear and tear.

The price difference between a relic and a 'new' guitar may seem like a lot but they aren't just grabbing a production guitar off the rack and hitting it with a screwdriver. It takes a lot of time ( = money ) to properly research and replicate these things, and they are typically done by a single or small group of builders.

Would I buy one? Nope. That's car or motorcycle level cash in my mind. But there is obviously a collector/enthusiast market that will, or you can be sure they wouldn't spend the time making them.

[Brandenburg]

So the concept of these guitars isn't really about how much they can charge for a beat up guitar. ( to a point anyways. )

What these types of guitars are targeted towards is someone who is a superfan of the artist and wants to have a guitar as close as humanly possible to what their hero played. You'd have a higher chance of winning a powerball lottery than getting your hands on one of Randy's guitars. But you can get one built as closely as possible as far as materials, dimensions, and simulated wear and tear.

The price difference between a relic and a 'new' guitar may seem like a lot but they aren't just grabbing a production guitar off the rack and hitting it with a screwdriver. It takes a lot of time ( = money ) to properly research and replicate these things, and they are typically done by a single or small group of builders.

Would I buy one? Nope. That's car or motorcycle level cash in my mind. But there is obviously a collector/enthusiast market that will, or you can be sure they wouldn't spend the time making them.

I wouldnt even spend that kind of money if it came from the artist own personal collection...I guess because i dont believe in hero worship.. I can say this.. rhodes.. clapton..blackmore..bowcott..murray..smith..etc.. all are awesome players but i dont idolize or worship them as guitar gods.. nor would I drop 10k on a guitar that they owned

on that note:
I expect people to worship me.. not the other way around.. (some of ya think im playing I bet.. LMAO tttttttttttttttt)

just my thoughts.. Its great people have more money than sense to spend on beat up instruments.. If I had that kind of money.. id have one of a kind custom guitars made by a respected luthier

people have lost their mind on the prices of just regular instruments.. nothing special IMO about a les paul or strat.. except for the bull shit price tags dealers/companies try to fuck over guitarist with now adays

[leftykingv2]

So the concept of these guitars isn't really about how much they can charge for a beat up guitar. ( to a point anyways. )

What these types of guitars are targeted towards is someone who is a superfan of the artist and wants to have a guitar as close as humanly possible to what their hero played. You'd have a higher chance of winning a powerball lottery than getting your hands on one of Randy's guitars. But you can get one built as closely as possible as far as materials, dimensions, and simulated wear and tear.

The price difference between a relic and a 'new' guitar may seem like a lot but they aren't just grabbing a production guitar off the rack and hitting it with a screwdriver. It takes a lot of time ( = money ) to properly research and replicate these things, and they are typically done by a single or small group of builders.

Would I buy one? Nope. That's car or motorcycle level cash in my mind. But there is obviously a collector/enthusiast market that will, or you can be sure they wouldn't spend the time making them.

I see where you're coming from bro and I am sure it's not easy to make a new guitar look identical to one that's been played and touring for 30 or 40 years. But on the other hand I think companies like Gibson in particular should spend more time and money on R&D and coming up with a new model rather than trying to sell 10 or 15K guitars that are beat up because they look like so and so's guitar. Relic or not it's a used/damaged instrument for a premium price. Just my opinion though and I respect your opinion on the matter too. I also see that kind of money as new bike or car money.

[Chad]

I see where you're coming from bro and I am sure it's not easy to make a new guitar look identical to one that's been played and touring for 30 or 40 years. But on the other hand I think companies like Gibson in particular should spend more time and money on R&D and coming up with a new model rather than trying to sell 10 or 15K guitars that are beat up because they look like so and so's guitar. Relic or not it's a used/damaged instrument for a premium price. Just my opinion though and I respect your opinion on the matter too. I also see that kind of money as new bike or car money.

For a company with a legacy like Gibson, creating a totally new model that would sell well is easier said than done.

Try to venture out with new designs/specs to reach consumers in the modern market and old school fans cry.

Stay with only the old school designs/specs, and people cry that you're losing touch and not innovative enough.

It's a difficult balance. Granted they've had some terrible attempts (reverse Flying V, backward Explorer, Firewood X, etc.), but even beyond those it's tough.

[leftykingv2]

For a company with a legacy like Gibson, creating a totally new model that would sell well is easier said than done.

Try to venture out with new designs/specs to reach consumers in the modern market and old school fans cry.

Stay with only the old school designs/specs, and people cry that you're losing touch and not innovative enough.

It's a difficult balance. Granted they've had some terrible attempts (reverse Flying V, backward Explorer, Firewood X, etc.), but even beyond those it's tough.

+1 but don't forget about the new Zakk Wylde model and the other terrible reissue of what ever that thing was with the maple neck and the weird shaped body. I think it's called an M III. It should be called an M II because that guitar is a big piece of number two!

[Chad]

+1 but don't forget about the new Zakk Wylde model and the other terrible reissue of what ever that thing was with the maple neck and the weird shaped body. I think it's called an M III. It should be called an M II because that guitar is a big piece of number two!

The new Zakk Wylde model is so bad, I literally can't look at it. I was on some website the other day and a pic of it showed up and I had to quickly move to another page. It's so bad, it's nauseating. lol. Wonder how many of those they will sell?

[leftykingv2]

If they sell one it's one too many in my opinion. Easily one of the ugliest things I've ever seen in 30 years of being a guitar player. I honestly can not think of something insulting enough to say about that "Thing.":dunno:

[roodyrocker]

I'm personally not a big fan of relicing because I like my guitars in as close to new shape as possible. however, I do understand the appeal to some people and if it makes them happy good for them. On artist models there is a big difference between a Concorde and a Les Paul. You can buy a regular Les Paul any time. You can't buy a Rhoads Concorde, Jackson won't build it for you. Your choices for a Concorde are either a Concorde Relic, an LTD, a 25th anniversary, or one of the 4 NAMM built LTD's. All are expensive. And btw, the Concorde Relic was over $12K list price not street price. Sure, its still an expensive guitar but also one that will continue to be valuable in the future. I have artist models from various manufaturers. I like them, I buy them, and I play them cause it makes me happy Some of the Les Paul signature models go up in value. So depending on the model it may be a better investment than you think. This isn't true of all of them but some.