Clinton's Dead Friends.....

[hippietim]

Here are a few the Bush family gets credit for: 9/11 victims, John F. Kennedy, Ken Lay, Leola McConnell, Sid Adger, General James Rose, Lt. Colonel William Harris, Jr., Lt. Colonel Jerry B. Killian, James Downing Aalund, J. Clifford Baxter, Charles Dana Rice, James Daniel Watkins, Commerce Secretary Ron Brown, Jake Horton, Hale Boggs, George de Mohrenschildt, Mrs. E. Howard Hunt, Gary Caradori, Orlando Letelier, Ronni Moffit, Jack Delaney, Ted White, Steve Kangas, Danny Casolaro, Mark Lombardi, James Hatfield, William S. Farish, James Forrestal, Karla Faye Tucker, David Wayne Spence, Gary Graham

[Joe_Steeler]

You forgot Pat Tilman.

[Trem]

These are not the droids you're looking for.

Buwahahaha :ROTF::ROTF::ROTF:

I am open to a lot of the insites of the so called "left", and some of them are pretty convincing.
However, i've had freinds that were way to soaked up in it, and they just couldn't enjoy their lives anymore, their cries that freedoms were being taken away and how we are being oppressed, in such a subtle way that were are actually asking for or demanding it, all part of the master plan theories, and were unable to see that they were in fact strangling their own freedoms and unable to escape the shadow of big brother were caused by themselves obsessing about it.
Take it all with a grain of salt, and don't take any shit, but just live your life, some things are out of your control, and ultimately, "who gives a fuck anyway". You'll be dead soon enough.

[RobRR]

I am open to a lot of the insites of the so called "left", and some of them are pretty convincing.
However, i've had freinds that were way to soaked up in it, and they just couldn't enjoy their lives anymore, their cries that freedoms were being taken away and how we are being oppressed, in such a subtle way that were are actually asking for or demanding it, all part of the master plan theories, and were unable to see that they were in fact strangling their own freedoms and unable to escape the shadow of big brother were caused by themselves obsessing about it.
Take it all with a grain of salt, and don't take any shit, but just live your life, some things are out of your control, and ultimately, "who gives a fuck anyway". You'll be dead soon enough.

Your friend is pretty much dead on, unfortunatley. The thing is, most have the same attitude as you (not meant in a bad way)... "Im gonna live my life and worry about myself, fuck the rest". Thats why most people dont really see whats going on... noone gives a crap about anything that doesent directly affect them... little do they realize that it really DOES affect them, but its so subtle and gradual that you dont realize it soon enough.

Im no left with conspiracy nut job, Im an American. I love what this country was FOUNDED to stand for, the ones who died protecting that... I know its still alive and out there, but the simple fact is, today EVERYTHING is driven by greed and power, and the only ones who are losing out are the common people, like you and me.

[thetroy]

It was always about power. Always will be too.

[Cygnus X1]

Your friend is pretty much dead on, unfortunatley. The thing is, most have the same attitude as you (not meant in a bad way)... "Im gonna live my life and worry about myself, fuck the rest". Thats why most people dont really see whats going on... noone gives a crap about anything that doesent directly affect them... little do they realize that it really DOES affect them, but its so subtle and gradual that you dont realize it soon enough.

Im no left with conspiracy nut job, Im an American. I love what this country was FOUNDED to stand for, the ones who died protecting that... I know its still alive and out there, but the simple fact is, today EVERYTHING is driven by greed and power, and the only ones who are losing out are the common people, like you and me.

And, I might add, look at George Washington, and why he has been purposefully diminished in history as a President. Study him, and you might understand why I came to understand what my elders taught me, and why,he was great, in more ways than being the first. After that, It has all gone a different direction. He knew the power of the office, and showed the necessary restraint, except for defense of the constitution. I'll not ramble, I agree with you.

[thetroy]

And, I might add, look at George Washington, and why he has been purposefully diminished in history as a President. Study him, and you might understand why I came to understand what my elders taught me, and why,he was great, in more ways than being the first. After that, It has all gone a different direction. He knew the power of the office, and showed the necessary restraint, except for defense of the constitution. I'll not ramble, I agree with you.

That's the most sane thing I've ever read in a discussion related to US politics.

I've always found it funny how they just say Washington was a great president without actually making note of anything he said or did. As it turns out, he would probably hate what has been done with the country.

[horns666]

Ahhh.. power and greed is a double edged sword..sure it's a "bad" thing..but alot of good comes from the bad..Well, America for one.

I blame women..Adam was happy fuckin' sheep until Eve came along and fucked him and the entire human race..COOL!

Basically..its all 'bout the pussy..and I can prove it!!!

[dd3keegs]

Your friend is pretty much dead on, unfortunatley. The thing is, most have the same attitude as you (not meant in a bad way)... "Im gonna live my life and worry about myself, fuck the rest". Thats why most people dont really see whats going on... noone gives a crap about anything that doesent directly affect them... little do they realize that it really DOES affect them, but its so subtle and gradual that you dont realize it soon enough.

You know what...that is what I was thinking too. Just as long as our own little lives aren't gravely effected....then let's over look the circumstances. Russian President Putin gets a Front page on Time Magazine as " Man of the Year", yet he systematically harasses and excutes all who oppose him. Even better... he Jails one the richest men in Russia, steals his assests. And takes them as his own. The Reigning Powers of this World are so Frigging Corrupt. Their just wearing a thin veneer of Honor, painted on by their Office and the Media. I guess it could drive a man mad, worrying about it. But, what the heck, living an honest life seems like the wiser choice to me.

[hippietim]

Ok, the leaders of the world are corrupt including our own and our allies and our enemies.

Now what? I think we can all safely agree that a post on the JCF that will fade off the first page in a day or two will not change anything.

As individuals what do you *really* think we can do? Vote? Ha! McCain, Obama, or Clinton - all three are poor choices. Nader? Well, he'd be an interesting change of pace I suppose.

What is your call to action? Are you going to organize the alternative movement? What are you folks prepared to sacrifice for change? Will you put yourself at risk? Your finances? Will you put "the cause" before providing for your family?

I don't think most people are, as RobRR put it, of the "gonna live my life and worry about myself, fuck the rest" mindset. Rather, I don't think people believe they can make a difference so they do the best they can to take care of things for themselves. Most people I know are just happy to get through the day and provide for their families.

[toejam]

I blame women..Adam was happy fuckin' sheep until Eve came along and fucked him and the entire human race..COOL!

Basically..its all 'bout the pussy..and I can prove it!!!

LOL Wasn't Adam fucking Lilith before Eve?

[RobRR]

That's the most sane thing I've ever read in a discussion related to US politics.

I've always found it funny how they just say Washington was a great president without actually making note of anything he said or did. As it turns out, he would probably hate what has been done with the country.

THATS WHAT IM SAYING!!!

This country has strayed so far from why it was formed... But as Tim said, what are we really to do? Yet ANOTHER presidential election and we have SHIT for choice. The only way to become president of this country is if you have TONS of money and the media likes you. Thats it... and THAT is whats killing us. Presidents arent elected because theyre the best man/woman for the job, theyre elected because theyre a select few that we have to choose from. Sure there are tons of other candidates, but do you hear about them? Do you see them on TV? Nope, because theyre not filthy rich pasty white old dude, black, or a woman.

Obama is probably going to win because hes black. Hillary probably wont win because of herself, not because shes a woman, but the weakness she shows.

And what REAL incentive is there to vote? How can people praise a system that elects a candidate who did NOT have the popular vote? Our votes should count, each and every one of ours, as a whole nation. Not seperate states. Thats one small way were getting fucked.

Next to the IRS and the Federal Reserve, the Electorial College is one of the worst thing to happen to this country.

[hippietim]

yeah, the electoral college seems to have run it's course. i don't see how it's applicable anymore.

and can someone explain to me why primaries are a good thing? all they do is reduce our actual choices in the end.

i think we should elect our president like american idol works. every moron in the country that wants a shot gets a shot. once we get it down to a pool of people that proven a reasonable amount of competency then we go week to week and vote people off. heck, we could even keep simon around.

[RobRR]

Its really a catch 22 though... "they" like how the system works, because it puts the people "they" want into office. Its not for us anymore... hasnt been for a long time, but its getting even worse. Dont people realize theres a problem when your stuck voting for a candidate you dont want, only because theyre the lesser of the evils? Its fucking sickening... and Ill be honest, when I think about it from time to time, it REALLY bothers me.

So many people gave so much for this country... and look whats happenning to it. Its sad, most foreigners hate us... But thats because they dont know who we really are... mostly though, because WE dont know who we really are anymore.

The system needs to change... no, It HAS to change. How thats going to happen, I dont know... but its probably not going to be easy.

[thetroy]

There won't be any change unless there's another Tea Party.

I do LOVE the American Idol idea though... that could seriously work.