“Metal” Mike Chlasciak

[Lev]

Re: “Metal” Mike Chlasciak

Thanks Baum... you cleared that up rather nicely [img]images/icons/smile.gif[/img]

[jackson1]

Re: “Metal” Mike Chlasciak

stratvox, whats happening! You are totally misunderstanding me. English is not my native language and i apologize for any misspelled words and funny wordings in my posts. But to read my post and interpret my intentions SO wrong is unbelieveable!

I am not going to comment on every bit you said and use a lot of bandwidth. I think you are very trigger-happy and i've never had such a rude AND wrong telling-off.

"Dumbass moron"... give me a break, will you?

So, let me make it very clear: I do not like the Nazis. The Nazis are NOT cool. That is my WHOLE POINT. I do not approve of any kind of war or killing. Read the posts again with that in mind and i am sure it will make sense to you.

Don't get back to me with a lot of nitpicking. Get my message: I DO NOT APPROVE OF NAZIS and glamourizing war and destruction.

Oh, one last thing. I am Danish. The little country RIGHT ON TOP OF GERMANY. Germany invaded us, we had Nazis all over. Jews and the resistance were hunted down and gassed. My father was a young boy in all this mess. I heard enough of this. So, when i see young death metal headbangers with swasticas tattoed on their heads or musicians with war symbols on their gear or whatever, i get sad. That is NOT cool.

Guys, do i really need an english class that bad?

[VitaminG]

Re: “Metal” Mike Chlasciak

Originally posted by jackson1:
Guys, do i really need an english class that bad?

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Not at all. I think your English is fine. To the point that I had no idea it wasn't your native tongue.

I think most of us understood what you meant in your post. It seems that Stratvox missed this part of your post:

Sometimes heavy metal just gets too connected to war and destruction in my opinion. I think this "equation" is often signalled in the heavy metal scene:

Metal = Maltese Cross = german tank = World War = Nazi = Cool!

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">That doesn't suggest to me that you condone what the Nazis did, or even that you personally think that symbols connected with the Nazis are cool. Just stating a fact. A lot of those symbols ARE adopted by young metalheads, often not for any political reason, but just for the bad-ass image it helps them project. "Oooh, you listen to Venom and have a swastika on your school book/guitar/forehead. How dangerous! You're really hardcore"

[chrisolson]

Re: “Metal” Mike Chlasciak

Originally posted by pro-fusion:
For what it's worth, the Germans did not use the Maltese Cross symbol on their tanks and planes in WWII. They used a more plain 'straight up and down' cross symbol. The only use of the Maltese Cross during WWII was in the Iron Cross award given to soldiers. And, unfortunately, the WWII Iron Crosses had a swastika embossed on the black part of the award. I know, because I purchased a WWI Iron Cross in German antique store some years ago--the WWII awards were in better condition, but I wouldn't go near anything with a swastika on it.

I'm not even sure why the Nazis used the regular cross symbol on their equipment in WWII, since the Nazis hated Christianity. But the army and air force commanders were not, as a general rule, committed Nazis and probably considered the traditions of their forces much more important than the current German rulership--and the Nazis couldn't entirely afford to piss off their entire military command structure, could they?

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Yep - you're right on the "cross" issue. They WERE NOT markings on the tanks and planes of the German army in WW2. They ARE, however, on the tanks and planes of POST-WAR West German (now unified Germany) military equipment. Lots of Leopard tanks, and Panavia Tornados with those markings, but NOT during WW2.

Just relax - I don't think anyone here is so thick-headed that they'd actually write something to the effect that Nazi Germany was "cool" in any way. Some pretty impressive uniforms and equipment, yes, but what they represented and fought for, NO!!!

[Black Mariah]

Re: “Metal” Mike Chlasciak

Didn't I already say that the Maltese Cross was NEVER USED ON NAZI EQUIPMENT? I'm not talking out of my ass, I looked that up a few months ago. And not every cross-shaped icon (such as that used on the Luftwaffe planes) is a religious symbol. It's just a plus sign, dammit!

Here's a hint... try paying attention next time. It saves a lot of useless posts saying the same damn thing.

*EDIT*

In regards to the import artists guitars. Yes, there were import artist guitars (Mustaine V, PC3, JJ) before these, but it was my understanding that it was going to be a whole line of import artist guitars out at the same time, not just a couple of models over a span of a few years. Given that I didn't see the PL2 (Pat Lachman's mutant SG guitar) in any NAMM pictures, I'd say that idea was scrapped. :|

[ March 04, 2003, 04:45 PM: Message edited by: Black Mariah ]

[shreddermon]

Re: “Metal” Mike Chlasciak

stratvox said:

You can tell me to back off when your great grandparents are slaughtered by an insane man just because of their religious beliefs.

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">No one's disagreeing with you taking offense at anything that glorifies Nazi war crimes and the like. But, as jackson1 himself has now explained, you misunderstood what he said. I think you owe him an apology, as you flamed him for some nasty things he did not say or intend.

As to your great-grandparents, my sincere condolences. Genocide is a sin against creation. Since they were your "great-grandparents" that gives an indication of your age and possible inexperience, though. I'll cut you some slack, and politely suggest that you might want to consider that others here might have been even MORE directly affected by such events than you yourself. My own parents were meager Italian farmers during the war. They hid from German forces in mountain caves to avoid being killed, and were fortunate enough to survive the war and later emigrate to the US. Some of their relatives were not so lucky.

[stratvox]

Re: “Metal” Mike Chlasciak

Jackson 1,

If i have misunderstood yout post i apologize. I also apologize to anyone who i may have offended by my post. As to questions of my age and maturity, i am 36 and have seen quite enough to be close to 60. anyone who wishes to discuss this matter is invited to email me privately.

Again, i apologize to those i may have offended. I wont be posting again on this matter.

[StuTDavis]

Re: “Metal” Mike Chlasciak

Eh, I think people put a little too much thought into things like this sometimes. For anyone who might actually be offended by what the guitar will look like...well, that's one thing. People get offended by things all the time. Just how far "sensitivity issues" should rule everyone's lives and their freedom to have the things they want could be pushed to an extreme limit, if everyone is given their way any time they complain about something. Sometimes things are just considered cool because the person thinks they look cool, regardless of "meaning".

I've got a guitar with the Grim Reaper with a bleeding heart in his empty chest, hanging over some impaled skulls with bloody "marks" from the Grim Reaper on their foreheads, in a graveyard...and cross inlays. Does it "mean" anything? It means I thought cross inlays would go well with the overall theme of the guitar, being that the scene is in a graveyard. Could it offend someone? Eh, I guess it probably could. Hell, you could say I'm trying to convey an anti-Christian idea that the Grim Reaper is Jesus, killing people and stripping their souls for his own evil pleasure. You could think anything! But, who cares...and most people who see it just say "that's f'n cool, dude!" hehehe.

Effects on kids, and public image of metal? Well, as far as any effects on kids...once you admit that things like that COULD affect kids negatively, then you're basically admitting that, yes, our beloved heavy metal could very well be linked to many suicides, and the cause of many violent acts. The same, then, could be said of movies, video games, and everything else that's constantly on the chopping block of the "save our poor kids' minds" issue. And metal's public image...well...isn't that part of the "metal mentality"--to be what you wanna be and not give a rip what anyone else thinks, and screw them if they don't like it? It's not country...where you're worried about upsetting housewives who might see their husband drooling over a nearly naked Shania Twain. It's freakin metal! It's SUPPOSED to be raw, it's SUPPOSED to be offensive! [img]images/icons/smile.gif[/img]

[Black Mariah]

Re: “Metal” Mike Chlasciak

I'm not even sure why the Nazis used the regular cross symbol on their equipment in WWII, since the Nazis hated Christianity.

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">I just noticed this line here. Umm... no. The Nazis did not hate Christianity, and in fact most Nazis were Christian. Hitler believed that Jews were evil because they WERE NOT Christian. Same with Gypsies.

Also, Metal Mike is not "Polish American". He was born in Poland and raised there. He is Polish, straight up. And any way you go at it IT'S STILL JUST A ****ING MALTESE CROSS. Could we please end this?

[shreddermon]

Re: “Metal” Mike Chlasciak

Stratvox: My apologies, as I've mis-inferred things myself, now. Thanks and [img]graemlins/toast.gif[/img]

[jackson1]

Re: “Metal” Mike Chlasciak

Originally posted by stratvox:
Jackson 1,

If i have misunderstood yout post i apologize.

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">You did indeed. Apology accepted and lets move on.

[Nazi-mode off, totally off]
Black Mariah: didn't you mention something about an early photo of this guitar some 6000 words back in this thread? Was it something you had in possesion or what are the chances we could get to see this?

[Black Mariah]

Re: “Metal” Mike Chlasciak

Kevin took a picture of me holding it in the generic "throwing horns, sticking tongue out" 80's metal pose and sent it to Metal Mike so he could see if before it was shipped. I don't know if it still exists anywhere though. The guitar isn't that hard to picture. It's a black neckthru warrior with white bevels and a white Maltese Cross on the upper wing.

[kuerbo]

Re: “Metal” Mike Chlasciak

Everything's ok Dude,

We're all human and can make mistakes.
Now for the topic, an import neckthrough will be great!!!

As for Mike, I saw him here in Santiago with Halford as opening act for Iron Maiden, and boy he sucked. I mean the guy did mistakes even in the rithym parts of Judas Priest songs!!! [img]images/icons/shocked.gif[/img]
Pat on the other side, played really well.

Just my two cents. [img]graemlins/images/icons/tongue.gif[/img]

[ March 04, 2003, 09:34 PM: Message edited by: kuerbo ]

[chrisolson]

Re: “Metal” Mike Chlasciak

Originally posted by Black Mariah:
Didn't I already say that the Maltese Cross was NEVER USED ON NAZI EQUIPMENT? I'm not talking out of my ass, I looked that up a few months ago. And not every cross-shaped icon (such as that used on the Luftwaffe planes) is a religious symbol. It's just a plus sign, dammit!

Here's a hint... try paying attention next time. It saves a lot of useless posts saying the same damn thing.

*EDIT*

In regards to the import artists guitars. Yes, there were import artist guitars (Mustaine V, PC3, JJ) before these, but it was my understanding that it was going to be a whole line of import artist guitars out at the same time, not just a couple of models over a span of a few years. Given that I didn't see the PL2 (Pat Lachman's mutant SG guitar) in any NAMM pictures, I'd say that idea was scrapped. :|

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Hey BM - I don't know who the hell made you the Posting Police, but if I feel like adding my thoughts, I WILL. So pay attention to this - if that post was aimed at me, kindly back off! [img]images/icons/mad.gif[/img] I don't remember you mentioning anything about the Maltese Cross and post-war Germany. So is it okay if I do? [img]graemlins/brow.gif[/img] Oh yeah - and if this thread bothers you so much and you want it to end, why do you keep posting in it? No one makes you click on it and read it - you could be part of the solution instead of part of the problem you know... No need to attack people - I'm sure you've probably made a redundant post before - we all have. [img]images/icons/wink.gif[/img]

[horns666]

Re: “Metal” Mike Chlasciak

I'm not sensitive... [img]images/icons/grin.gif[/img]

Somebody, please warn Stratvox about me .... [img]graemlins/laugh.gif[/img]

Oh BTW Metal Mike is the closest guitarist I've ever heard that is closest to my style. I freaked when I picked his solo stuff....sounds like me screwing around

[ March 04, 2003, 11:26 PM: Message edited by: horns666 ]