Air Force$35 billion contract

[fett]

Up here, it would be about 3000 jobs that would last for years. Now, Boeing is going to faze out the 767. Why does this suck? I don't know.

[pott]

Nothing personal. I owned two '60's Renaults. How French does that get?:ROTF:

Surely more French that I would ever get, thank fuck


Mhmm ok I think I see what you mean about the pilot's role... on another hand FBW does allow for more computer but it has its uses, though admitedly not as much in a liner than in a fighter. Modern fighters are designed to be UNstable, and these computers stabilize it in real time (simplified but yeah...). Or did you mean something else? I'm no pilot unfortunately even though it's been my lifelong dream..

The other advantage was that all 320/19/28/21/30/40/80 share globally the same cockpits and functions. Much less expensive to train pilots... well for those who have these types of aircrafts already. Like you said it's true that if you know how to pilot a 707/KC135 or a DC10/KC10 those things will seem weird. But in the future if the USAF wishes to replace their C135s or C141s they could go for A330s and save pilot training costs.

I think the joystick's cool though. I mean F16s and Rafales have the same. Can't be that bad

What I thinik is, in an airliner, the pilot's main tasks are landing and taking off. If these can be reduced to a more acceptable workload through the use of computers, why not? They work after all, or so it seems so far. The 330/340 is a great, efficient design.

And I think it's a beautiful aircraft too but unfortunately that means nothing

[JacksonDean]

Surely more French that I would ever get, thank fuck


Mhmm ok I think I see what you mean about the pilot's role... on another hand FBW does allow for more computer but it has its uses, though admitedly not as much in a liner than in a fighter. Modern fighters are designed to be UNstable, and these computers stabilize it in real time (simplified but yeah...).

The other advantage was that all 320/19/28/21/30/40/80 share globally the same cockpits and functions. Much less expensive to train pilots... well for those who have these types of aircrafts already. Like you said it's true that if you know how to pilot a 707/KC135 or a DC10/KC10 those things will seem weird.

I think the joystick's cool though. I mean F16s and Rafales have the same. Can't be that bad

Fact is, in an airliner, the pilot's main tasks are landing and taking off. If these can be reduced to a more acceptable workload through the use of computers, why not? They work after all, or so it seems so far. The 330/340 is a great, efficient design.

And I think it's a beautiful aircraft too but unfortunately that means nothing

Absolutely in agreement with you in regards to fighters. I don't have a problem with FBW; I think it's a logical step forward. And as Boeing has implemented it in the 777, I think it's a benefit to airlines in terms of cost and control, reporting, etc. But what Boeing's modeled into their FBW systems is the ability for a pilot to not only over ride the FBW with insistence of the input on the control, but also the ability to turn it off.

Yes, the pilot's role is pretty much limited to take offs and landings (and may your log book always show a 1:1 ratio! )

The side stick controller is a nifty little thing, and I actually understand why they incorporated that in their aircraft. Again, though, I tend to agree with Boeing's philosophy on cockpit design: just because we can, doesn't mean we should. The 777 has the standard yoke for pilot "comfort" (familiarity, etc).

Of course, at a certain point, should this contract have the same run that the previous one did, this point'll be moot since the newer pilots will be trained to deal with the Side Stick controller. So... I guess we'll have to get used to seeing grey A330s flying around the skies over Peterson AFB. I may have to accept it, but I don't have to like it!

[pott]

Fair enough point. But come on, they're sexy beasts The last pretty plane you guys did was the F16s...



Ah I'm just messing . Though I do love the F16s, absolutely stunning. But they ain't no Rafale...

I gotta say I have no idea why they implemented the side stick either. More ergnomic, less movement required..? After all with hydraulics you need some strength for some moves. With FBW that's not required anymore, so the stick can be smaller and to the side..? No real clue.

[pott]

AH! I think I can see why. No bigass yoke at the center = more room for bigger screens = clearer way of telling the pilots the flight parameters and other info. That could be why it's on the side, it's not obstrusive.

[Blazer]

And let's not forget the fact that USAF has been using overseas made aircraft for YEARS.

The AV 8 Harrier for example.



Or the T45 Goshawk.


Which are both Brittish made planes.

[CharvelRocker]

I thought Both of those were made under license in the US. McDonald Douglas used to have on the Harrier contract along the Goshawk. BAE built some, but Boeing/McDonald Douglas builds the US market one. Same way Mitsubishi builds versions of the F-15 and F16 for the JASDF.

[fett]

Damnit. That's not the point. Who gives a shit about how cool a plane looks? Boeing just fukked up and the US confirmed it. This is a slap in the face done by us to us. Total BS.

[Cygnus X1]

Damnit. That's not the point. Who gives a shit about how cool a plane looks? Boeing just fukked up and the US confirmed it. This is a slap in the face done by us to us. Total BS.

Well, how many sweetheart deals can you stand?
People are still bitching about Haliburton contracts, but they aren't doing all that great, profit wise.
Competition is a good thing.

[ABSOLUT CHARVEL]

Competition is a good thing. But, a contract of that magnatude once again is not a good thing as far as jobs are concerned in the US. Hard to say if this is a make up call after the Air Force & Boeing fiasco a few years ago. I just hate to see tax money spent over seas plus adding unemployment here. I guess Boeing HQ that is now in Chicago really got caught with their pants down. Again, competition is good for the private sector like airlines, buy goverment ... I don't know.

I know not long ago here, the city of Bellevue bought some euro cars for the police. Man it cause a shit storm and that was on the local level....

[Ace]

Eh, I'm French and I don't poke at the yanks... yet

Well DUH! You can't make fun of us! We're perfect!

[fett]

Me living in Wash State has little bearing on how much this sucks. It is a gigantic case of not taking care of us. Let's just forget about jobs here. What? They saved a few bucks. I just don't get it. I am really not very happy about all this. Let me get this straight. We are about or in a recession. The Fed is all concerned. The credit market is DEAD. And what do those bastards do? They farm it out. This, our, country has me perplexed.

[pott]

Well DUH! You can't make fun of us! We're perfect!

Nah,we just prefer challenges.

[åron]

Me living in Wash State has little bearing on how much this sucks. It is a gigantic case of not taking care of us. Let's just forget about jobs here. What? They saved a few bucks. I just don't get it. I am really not very happy about all this. Let me get this straight. We are about or in a recession. The Fed is all concerned. The credit market is DEAD. And what do those bastards do? They farm it out. This, our, country has me perplexed.

Not that this will make you feel better, but we would have saved money with the Boeing planes. 35 mill per plane.

I don't quite get it either. Though after the last Boeing bid fiasco, no doubt their hands were tied in persuading the Pentagon to sign on. Airbus likely made the right offers to the right people. Having a better product would make it an easier sell.

[petedz]

I thought it was pretty simple. The Northrup/Grumman plane carries more gas.

The rest is just politics.