EMGs in a cheap Ibanez

Okay. Bear with me here- this is rather new territory for me.
I have an Ibanez GAX30 with stock neck and bridge humbuckers. Actually, I'm rather fond of my little guitar here, it has a really great sound and resonates beautifully...but I was thinking of throwing some EMGs in there. I like the idea of spiffing up cheap guitars.
Any thoughts on this?

[ApeDosMil]

Re: EMGs in a cheap Ibanez

Good Idea! Get a 85 at the bridge, it sounds heavy and gives a good umph compared to the 81 which is a little brighter then the 85.

[toejam]

Re: EMGs in a cheap Ibanez

Do it! You can't go wrong with EMGs. I'm also partial to the 85 in the bridge with either an 81 or 60 in the neck. [img]images/icons/grin.gif[/img]

[Emthrax]

Re: EMGs in a cheap Ibanez

Yes, definitely the 85 as the bridge pup- that's what I was thinking. I'm a rhythm guitarist, and I think this would suit the sound I'm ulitmately after.
I have a three way switch and either play just the bridge or will switch to the middle position if I'm playing clean.
I wasn't sure which one to go for for the neck pickup- but I was thinking an 81?
Thanks you guys for your input. [img]images/icons/grin.gif[/img]

Em

[Newc]

Re: EMGs in a cheap Ibanez

If you've never had EMGs, be prepared for a disappointment - I put an 81 in the bridge of an Ibanez EX350 a few years ago and thought it sounded like crap - very thin and nasally with no balls (or rather, even thinner, more nasally, and less ballsy than the stock IBZ pickup). That's when I realized you need a ton of external EQ with EMGS to shape a sound.

Newc

[Number Of The Priest]

Re: EMGs in a cheap Ibanez

[img]graemlins/scratchhead.gif[/img] I've got an 81 (hark! [img]images/icons/tongue.gif[/img] ) in the bridge of my RG560 and it added a lot of "snap" to that dark-sounding guitar.

But still, I'm convinced the 85 is the better pickup for the bridge position. [img]images/icons/grin.gif[/img]

[StuTDavis]

Re: EMGs in a cheap Ibanez

I'm a huge EMG fan, but I'll be the first to say, even EMGs can't save some guitars. I've had some flat, dead-sounding guitar purchase mistakes in the past, and hoped that my beloved EMGs would save them, but they didn't.

If you already honestly like the sound of a cheap guitar with stock pickups, and you just want to change it a little, then you might do yourself a big favor by putting better pickups in it. If you don't already really like the basic sound of the guitar all that much, then there's a good chance sticking new pickups in it is going to be a waste of time, effort and money.

Stu

[Emthrax]

Re: EMGs in a cheap Ibanez

Hmm... alright. Some good points here on both sides of the track. Thank You!

Yes, I do like the basic sound of the guitar. It has kind of a darky sound to it- but it can't quite put out the crunch I'm looking for. Playing clean its beautiful- very warm and full. I thought about just upgrading the humbuckers to some Seymour Duncans instead. But I've heard these EMGs and didn't know if they would do all that much for this little Ibby here. [img]graemlins/brow.gif[/img]

[ABSOLUT CHARVEL]

Re: EMGs in a cheap Ibanez

Well Em, I see you lost your virgin status, so now you can do the classifieds and see if anyone could hook you up. Man, you got around fast.

[Emthrax]

Re: EMGs in a cheap Ibanez

Originally posted by ABSOLUT CHARVEL:
Well Em, I see you lost your virgin status, so now you can do the classifieds and see if anyone could hook you up. Man, you got around fast.

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Not a virgin anymore, huh? LOL! [img]graemlins/laugh.gif[/img] I haven't decided quite what I'm doing yet with this Ibanez- we'll see. Also haven't decided which Jackson I want either- there are a few! When I figure this all out I'll go huntin' around the classifieds. Thanks dudes.

[StuTDavis]

Re: EMGs in a cheap Ibanez

Yeah, that "darky" sound is exactly how the guitars I've had that COULDN'T be helped by EMGs sounded. That characteristic, to me, seems generally associated with (no offense) cheap, crappy wood. My one guitar in particular that I remember trying EMGs in that still sounded like total poo afterwards sounded better but still "darky". The guitar itself was just cheap and made of cheap materials--nothing was going to help it, and it never would "crunch" as you say.

It all depends on what you've got to work with--sometimes you're just not going to ever get the results you want. I'd be especially concerned if you have other guitars that "crunch" just fine, but this one doesn't. Even with crappy pickups, a GOOD guitar used on a GOOD, well-set-up "metal" amp/rack setup should "crunch" to some extent. Might not be EXACTLY the "crunch" tone you want (maybe a little brighter, maybe a little darker) but it should still "crunch" fairly well. If not, I'd suspect the guitar's a stinker hehehe.

If you don't have any reference to go by, though, meaning no other guitars you've used with your setup and HAVE got good "crunch" from, then the guitar is only one of the likely suspects. Could be the amp/rack, could be your settings. The best situation is when you have a KNOWN high-quality guitar with KNOWN high-quality parts and pickups, and a KNOWN high-quality amp/rack that's KNOWN to be set up well to get the sound you want. Then, when you bring some other guitar in to try, you can more validly guess if it's the guitar that's crappy or just its pickups.

Stu

Originally posted by Emthrax:

Yes, I do like the basic sound of the guitar. It has kind of a darky sound to it- but it can't quite put out the crunch I'm looking for.

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">

[Emthrax]

Re: EMGs in a cheap Ibanez

Stu-
That is exactly what I was wondering and this is just the kind of information I am wanting to hear. Thank You.
This Ibanez has a basswood body ( I know nothing about basswood) and a maple neck. It is not the highest quality, no, and LOL- no offense taken! [img]graemlins/laugh.gif[/img]
Yes, I can get some wicked crunch on this axe but not quite the bite I want. You know, crunchy like Captain Crunch cereal crunchy. Only way I can describe it.
I suspect its the guitar, yes. I've played others through my set-up and they're fine. And I've played this guitar through known better set-ups compared with higher quality guitars, and yes, its my guitar. LOL! It sounds better on better set-ups, its decent, just not in your face.
I think I mentioned that this Ibanez has a nice bright, but warm, sound when played clean. Playing just the bridge pup though it can get muddy if I'm not careful with my tone. Which is why I'm considering the upgrade. And I'm looking at DiMarzios now instead because with the already dark tendency this guitar seems to have, I don't want to emphasise that. I wonder if the EMGs would do that.
I didn't want to waste money on upgrading to better pickups either if its just not going to do any good. The money is better spent towards a better guitar. Like the Jackson I do not have. Yet. [img]images/icons/shocked.gif[/img]
So there ya go. I think on it some more. [img]graemlins/scratchhead.gif[/img]
Thanks people.
Em

[Number Of The Priest]

Re: EMGs in a cheap Ibanez

I don't know if you're open to DiMarzio pickups, but I've heard that they're a match made in heaven for Ibanez players. Obviously this is a very sweeping generalization, but there's gotta be a reason why some of the higher-end basswood-bodied Ibanez guitars have DiMarzio pickups in them.

More sweeping generalizations of matches made in heaven:

-Jackson and Seymour Duncan
-ESP and EMG-81s/EMG-HZ4s

[img]images/icons/tongue.gif[/img]

[StuTDavis]

Re: EMGs in a cheap Ibanez

Emthrax,

You're welcome. [img]images/icons/smile.gif[/img] And, opinions will vary, but personally I'm not a fan of basswood. I had a basswood USA Ibanez Custom not too long ago. Yup...stuck an EMG-81 in it, too. Ehh...even with that...it was alright...but nowhere near like my other high-end guitars, and when ditching guitars time came around, it got ditched hehehe. Number of the Priest is right, though, DiMarzio and Ibanez seem to typically go together like ice cream and ice cream cones...kinda meant to be together hehehe. Many players just seem to like that combination.

Since you asked about pickups being dark, I don't personally consider the EMGs to be dark at all. Their character is overall fairly clear and open. The 81 moreso than the 85, I believe, partly because of the difference in magnet material.

Well, I would say, I don't think going on clean sound at all is a good way to go. Even some of the crappiest guitars can get a decent clean sound, to my ears. That guitar I had...sounded fine on clean...just couldn't do thrash stuff worth a darn hehehe.

Is your name somehow linked to being a fan of Anthrax? If so, cool...that's my territory, totally. [img]images/icons/grin.gif[/img]

Anyway, I'll try to describe the sound of that guitar I had better. Like yours, it just wouldn't get "crunchy" enough. The sound AND feel were both pretty much...round, I guess you could say. Neither the sound nor the response/feel were very defined. It all just seemed a bit limp. A good, high-quality guitar should feel and sound tight and solid. This guitar's feel was kind of loose, and its sound was just round and blah--even with an EMG-81. There was no chord and note definition to speak of, and without that tightness, there's just no good "crunch" there.

As a side note, I opened that guitar up later, dug around, and realized the guitar's body was made of plywood. Yep, plywood. Might have been alder plywood or basswood plywood, or some other sort of "tonewood" made into plywood, but it was definitely plywood--you could see the layers and everything. It was at that point that I became very skeptical about the quality of cheaper guitars. Did that guitar "crunch"? Ehh...sorta...in a flat, blah kinda way, just barely. Mostly it just sounded flat and lifeless, though...no real character.

Though some guys will say they have taken cheap guitars and turned them into "awesome axes" by changing pickups and/or hardware, I just don't buy it. My guess is they won't be satisfied with it for very long, but you know, nobody ever comes back and says "guess what guys that cheap guitar I told you was so awesome before...well...I spoke too soon...turns out it was still a piece of crap, and I've bought something else since"...hehehe.

I'm saying if your guitar sounds REALLY REALLY close to exactly how you want it to sound, then it might be worth the risk. But, there's an equal chance you'll be throwing money down a hole, too. If it's not REALLY REALLY close already, and you still can't get ANY decent real crunch out of it with a high-end amp or rack setup, then I'd say save the money you'd otherwise spend on the pickups and put it towards a high end guitar, if that's a reasonble likelihood for you. With a high end guitar you won't have any reason to question whether it's the guitar anymore. At that point, if it doesn't sound good with an amp or rack setup you KNOW you like, you know it's not the guitar itself, then you can consider the pickups a good suspect to change out...or that you need to practice some more hehehe.

Stu

[Emthrax]

Re: EMGs in a cheap Ibanez

[/QB][/QUOTE] With a high end guitar you won't have any reason to question whether it's the guitar anymore. At that point, if it doesn't sound good with an amp or rack setup you KNOW you like, you know it's not the guitar itself, then you can consider the pickups a good suspect to change out...or that you need to practice some more hehehe.

Stu [/QB][/QUOTE]

LOL! True. [img]graemlins/laugh.gif[/img]
And yes, Priest, I am considering DiMarzio. [img]images/icons/smile.gif[/img] Thank You!

Hey Stu,
YES. HUGE Anthrax fan. Scott Ian is my idol, he's the main dude that inspired me to be a rhythm guitarist. Don't get me started on Anthrax, I will never shut up.

Anyway. Yes- this is beginning to sound more and more familiar. You talking me out of this aren't you? J/K
Yeah, my Ibanez is responsive but its a little loose, could be tighter. I know exactly what you are describing. You can tell the difference definitely. I mean, it sounds fine- but not FINE!
Oh man, now I want to take it apart and see what its really made of. I'm very curious. I suspect that the neck may not all be maple either. [img]graemlins/brow.gif[/img]

I know about the DiMarzio/Ibanez love affair- Vai and Joe I know are big fans. I started looking into these pickups as well, and I think if anything will help it will most likely be these. It may be a long-shot I know. Yeah, you're right. I know a few dudes that spiff up cheapo axes and they're pleased with their efforts.
Maybe its a 50/50 chance, I dunno if I would be mad or not if new pups didn't help any. Couldn't be worse, that's for sure.
I would rather have something I know is going to put out what I want than have to guess though.
Hmmm... maybe I need to start batting my lashes round the classifieds.

Thanks so much for your input you guys. [img]graemlins/headbang.gif[/img]

Em