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Top Mount v. Recessed Trem

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  • #61
    Originally posted by bratfink View Post
    If I break a string I can usually get it pretty close to correct just by using the fine tuning knobs and I can convert to drop D and reset tuning only using the fine tuner knobs.
    Right, and the floyd thats sitting on the body isnt pretty close to correct, its still in perfect tune. and when you drop D, thats all you have to do. no other fine tuning needed. I have guitars with both, full floating and sitting on the body obvious pros and cons to both, no real preference either.

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    • #62
      But that's my point. If you don't want the functionality of the floyd (i.e. up and down dives) why buy a floyd. Let me put it another way, why spend the extra dollars on an expensive trem then install and set it up like a cheap trem? Why not just buy the cheap trem?

      If you are so worried about string breaks and staying in tune then a floyd (or kahler) probably isn't for you. Now occasional string breaks do happen, but I have to say that I almost never break strings (and I am playing death metal), so if you are breaking strings a lot then you probably want to consider altering your technique. If you want to switch between std and drop tuning all the time, stop being a cheap skate and buy another guitar! Now say you want to play a set in both tunings and break at least a string a set, then you need 4 guitars. Having 4 great guitars cannot be a bad thing (apart from to your pocket book!).

      But I understand that there are those who are financially limited and want to do it all with 1 guitar. In which case I revert to my original point: Why buy the expensive floyd and use it like a cheap trem?

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      • #63
        your arguement is that a dive only is not a fully functioning floyd. a floyd was not designed with the intent of raising pitch, it was built to be a usable more stable alternative to a V-trem. the first NON fine tuner floyds and early floyd conversions we primarily dive only since guitar builders werent yet building neck angle into boltons. which is why MOST of the early floyd conversions are either dive only or have shims in the neck pockets. Once they did that and people realized what a locking floyd w fine tuners was capable of, pulling up and raising pitch, neck angle and back routes became common to take advantage of this added tuning stability. As for why buy an expensive trem if your not going to use it to its full capable of, ask EBMM, Wayne and others why they build "high end" guitars w floyds like that.

        cheap V-trems go out of tune when you dive bomb them, floyds don't.

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        • #64
          Ask EVH why his Floyd only does divebombs and he's never had a need to pull up.
          I feel my soul go cold... only the dead are smiling.

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          • #65
            Originally posted by j2379 View Post
            your arguement is that a dive only is not a fully functioning floyd. a floyd was not designed with the intent of raising pitch, it was built to be a usable more stable alternative to a V-trem..
            So if the floyd was designed as a more stable alternative to the V-Trem why is there a need to ground it under the backplate in order to be able to palm mute? Doesn't sound very stable to me.

            Or could it be that people are not setting them up correctly? I personally don't have any stability issue on heavy palm muting with either of my floyds, so it totally mistifies me what everyone else is doing wrong.

            It stands to reason the Floyd is an evolution of the V-Trem. But what I am asking is this; after the floyd has continued to evolve and all it's possibilities become apparent why would you continue to use it in the manner it was first designed?

            I am kinda playing devils advocate here, becuase in all honesty I don't really care what people do with their guitars. Although, I am a little lost on why people would purposefully order a part to operate in an obsolete fashion. I get that people want to do what they saw EVH do. But I do get a bit tired of this 'it was better in the old days' attitude I see in guitar people. Jackson became a guitar brand that pushed the possilbities of playing by introducing new technology. Just has Fender had done 40 years earlier. We all complain that we see Fenders for sale for $6+k when it's design hasn't been upgraded since 1956, so how are we being different by demanding a J/C is built just as it was in 1984?

            I am the first to admit I prefer a non-recessed trem, which limits me to pretty much buying pre 1990 models (unless I go CS), but at some stage you have to get up-to-date.

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            • #66
              tuning stability not trem stability. floyds stay in tune much better than V-trems. i prefer non recessed full floating floyds but its nice to have one or 2 thats setup not floating. especially when jamming with people, the ability to tune up or down a bit quickly is great. I do my own setup and have for many years, I know its not a big deal to twist a screw driver to adjust the spring claw and relevel the floyd, but with a non floater its just easier and quicker. sure its dive only but its as stable as a TOM when its sitting on the body, especially for someone like me that likes to use 10's or 10-52's or 11's tuned to standard pitch.

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              • #67
                Originally posted by toejam View Post
                Ask EVH why his Floyd only does divebombs and he's never had a need to pull up.
                Ask Brad Gillis how his strat body was crudely recessed for pullups when the Floyd Rose were still prototypes.
                The 2nd Amendment: America's Original Homeland Defense.

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                • #68
                  My first few Jacksons had Floyds on them, but after a while, I wasn't using them (the Floyds) much. Add to that that it was a bit of hassle to have to adjust it all the time due to weather changes and that my sweat makes them rust (maybe I should change my diet or something ). So, now I have a whole bunch of Jacksons with TOMs and only one with a Floyd. I also feel like I have better control over my vibrato and bends with the TOMs. Now, I wouldn't mind having a couple of guitars with on-recessed Floyds as I could have them rest against the body and tighten the springs, but they are kind of hard to come by. I have a back box installed in my one Jackson with a Floyd.

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                  • #69
                    Originally posted by xenophobe View Post
                    Ask Brad Gillis how his strat body was crudely recessed for pullups when the Floyd Rose were still prototypes.
                    Hear hear.

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