Need Technical help on some rack gear Please

[tonemonster]

OK guys, I need some help on some rack gear queestions. First off, I am looking to add a few components to my PA. Now I have a carvin board with EQ going direct into my carvin power amp. I am considering adding a BBE sonic Maximizer, a Compressor/Noise Gate/limiter, and possibly a feedback eliminator. What do you guys recommend I use or dont use? I have a BBE in my guitar rack and like what it does there. but do I need a certain model for a PA system? also, whats the deal with some BBE units having balanced jacks and some have unbalanced jacks? Do all the units need to be "balanced" or "unbalanced" to work together? or will this cause any problems mixing balanced with unbalanced? I dont understand that one, can someone explain that? WIll it matter if I use it with those other units? also What should the arrangement of the signal chain be? How bout the cable format on these units, should it be XLR or 1/4 jacks? whats best as certain models have specific jacks? The stage snake will probably have 1/4 returns from the board so thats what it will go in the rack with.

This stuff is a bit out of my league as I have always stayed in the "guitar realm" with gear. Please help a confused JCFer out [img]graemlins/scratchhead.gif[/img]

I appreciate any help you can provide [img]images/icons/smile.gif[/img] [img]images/icons/smile.gif[/img] Thanks

[Ace]

Re: Need Technical help on some rack gear Please

From what I know about guitars, I know very little about PA's, but here's what I think:

Balanced 1/4" jacks are stereo jacks that send the same signal down two wires in the cable, and of course you have a ground in there. The two signals are out of phase with each other, and when noise reaches the cable it will be in-phase with itself in both signals. When the unit on the recieving end re-aligns the two out of phase guitar signals, it is then the noise that is out of phase with itself, and cancels itself out. Don't follow? Don't worry, here's the important part:

Since an unbalanced input treats the part of the plug that the balanced, out of phase, signal is sent as a ground, the out of phase signal is not used but either sent to ground or left disconnected. So, you don't get the benefits of having a balanced cable, but you don't hurt anything either.

If you want to use a balanced signal in your PA, go for it. It will cost you a few extra bucks, and only you can decide if it's worth it.

As for a Compressor/Gate/Limiter the dbx 166XL is pretty standard, and they go for about $250 new. The Alesis 3630 isn't as transparent, but MF has them on sale right now for $100, I think. These should both go last in your signal path. Hope I helped!!

[tonemonster]

Re: Need Technical help on some rack gear Please

Hey thanks Ace!! [img]images/icons/grin.gif[/img] I appreciate it [img]images/icons/grin.gif[/img] [img]images/icons/smile.gif[/img]

Anyone else got any input on the myriad of questions I asked? [img]graemlins/scratchhead.gif[/img]

[OnlineStageGear]

Re: Need Technical help on some rack gear Please

Balanced = Stereo.

[tonemonster]

Re: Need Technical help on some rack gear Please

Thanks Matt [img]images/icons/grin.gif[/img]

Now, how about any of those other issues? What about those other components? any idea of what order they should go in the signal chain? [img]graemlins/scratchhead.gif[/img]

Anybody got any input? [img]graemlins/idea2.gif[/img]

[Jester700]

Re: Need Technical help on some rack gear Please

I would never strap a BBE across the mains; use it on individual tracks that need it. PA horns are peaky enough already and a BBE on the mains will make somebody's ears bleed. ;-)

The dbx is fine, but if you're using it in stereo the FMR RNC is a more transparent unit. Problem is, it's dual not mono, it's stereo only. If $200 for that is too much, the Behringer Composer is in the $100 range, and is at least better than the Alesis, IMO.

Go balanced where you can, but don't stress over it in a small rig.

[tonemonster]

Re: Need Technical help on some rack gear Please

Thanks Jesse, [img]images/icons/smile.gif[/img]

OK. That helps, I didnt think of a BBE been too punchy on highs. My PA sounds good, I just want to "tune it up" a bit. I thought these would be good choices. I am certianly going to add the Comp/Gate/Limiter and I am looking seriously at an Anti feedback unit too(possibly a Behringer) and The BBE, I can always use the BBe else where if it dont work. They are relatively inexpensive used and I can always use it elsewhere or sell it if its too punchy in the mix.

How bout signal chain?? anyone know what the best order these three components should go in the chain? [img]graemlins/scratchhead.gif[/img]

Here is my idea:

Carvin board with EQ
Feedback eliminator
BBE
Comp/Gate/Limiter
Power amp

DOes this sound right? Or is there a better layout?

[Jester700]

Re: Need Technical help on some rack gear Please

I would reverse your FX chain. The BBE should go after the comp, because the comp may skoosh what you're trying to do with the BBE (assuming you decide to use it; be on guard for slightly goosing the highs over the length of a show - by the end you could be peeling paint with treble). Or, one thing comps can do if you use too much is dull the treble - the BBE might help there.

Really, this is nitpicky - on mains you shouldn't use enough of either of these FX for it to matter, IMO.

I'd guess the feedbacker should be LAST before the amp. It really should "hear" the signal going to the speaker to do its job. But I don't use one of these, so check the manual - it may state a preferenc.

Personally, I'd leave the comp & BBE off the mains and have them ready to plug into channel inserts.

[OnlineStageGear]

Re: Need Technical help on some rack gear Please

Yes, the feedback eliminator should be last. Any signal or frequency the feedback eliminator might reduce may get boosted again by the compressor.

Matt