24 Frets vs 22 Frets and Picke Up Placement

[shredmonster]

I have read some builders don't make 24 fret necks because they claim harmonics are lost as a result of the pickup placement.

Especially with the neck pick up. I would have thought everything could be built to proportion.

Many of the builders also usually add that they don't get many requests for 24 fret necks so maybe it is more for that reason.

True I think most people don't demand the aggressive playability in a guitar that Jacksons have so I wonder about the pick up placement theory.

hmmmmmmmmmmmmmm?

[nonamemx]

Re: 24 Frets vs 22 Frets and Picke Up Placement

There may be some truth to the harmonics bit, but there isnt enought of a difference to make a hoot of a difference.

Lots of people just want 22 fretters because all the old guitars were 22 fretters (most grew up learning on Pauls and Strats and Teles) and that makes them feel more like the old tried and true classics they love.

22 fret guitars also feel different. IMO, they feel more solid, and I like the solid feel, and because the neck is that much shorter, it has potential for added sustain, tone, string-to-wood vibration transfer and all that stuff.

And some people dont ever use that 24th fret.

[toejam]

Re: 24 Frets vs 22 Frets and Picke Up Placement

Well, 24-fret guitars put the pickups closer to each other so that the neck pup sounds brighter than it would on a 22-fretter. A lot of people argue that the neck pup sounds warmer and just better on the 22-fretter, but I prefer brighter neck pups anyway. Either way, it's not that big of a deal and I'll play either combination.

Ed Roman actually claims that 24-fretters are better than 22 because harmonics are lost in the 22-fretters. Then again, we all know Ed doesn't know half the crap he's talking about anyway, so take anything he says with a grain, err, a bucket of salt.

[thetroy]

Re: 24 Frets vs 22 Frets and Picke Up Placement

Here's what makes sense to me:

Each side is half correct. If the neck pickup is moved to a different place along the string to accomodate the 2 extra frets, a different set of harmonics will be stronger at that point. So either way you "lose" some harmonics unless someone makes an 11-fret guitar with a giant pickup going from the bridge to where the 12th fret would be.

Bottom line: They will sound slightly different, but one is not "better" than the other. It comes down to personal preference.

[Newc]

Re: 24 Frets vs 22 Frets and Picke Up Placement

The difference in the length of 22 and 24 fret fretboards is too small to noticeably affect sustain or tone or vibration transfer.
Two identical guitars (same wood for the body, neck, fretboard, same fret size, same paintjob and type, same everything) whose only difference is number of frets will not sound completely different solely due to the extra or lack of 2 frets. A Les Paul will always sound different than a Dinky, and a Strat, and a Soloist, and a King V.

In the case of Jacksons, from what I've noticed, there is usually a deeper cut made into the lower horn to allow easier access to the 24th fret, which in turn makes it much easier to grab the 22nd fret.
In the case of a RR or KV or KE, they pretty much just move the neck pickup back and stick the 24 fret board on, but if you compare 22 fret SLs and DKs, the last fret on each one is almost always in the same place.

Newc

[spencer4hire]

Re: 24 Frets vs 22 Frets and Picke Up Placement

I would like to hear sound clips of lets say SLATQH & SL2MAH with same amp and same settings. Or perhaps PRS 22 &24. I think there is more of a difference than most people think. Local music store has DC Les Paul(24 fret) & it doesn't sound as good as reg Les paul with same pickups & woods. Why did Randy spec his gtr as 22 fret anyone know?

[Number Of The Priest]

Re: 24 Frets vs 22 Frets and Picke Up Placement

[ QUOTE ]
Why did Randy spec his gtr as 22 fret anyone know?

[/ QUOTE ]

I could be wrong, but I don't think 24 fretted necks were popular or well-known enough at the time for Randy to consider 24 frets.

[mm2002]

Re: 24 Frets vs 22 Frets and Picke Up Placement

Randy could have played a 12 fret guitar and made it sound fantastic.

[lerxstcat]

Re: 24 Frets vs 22 Frets and Picke Up Placement

The distance from nut to bridge is the same for the same scale neck, whether it has 22 or 24 frets, so the neck's not really longer, just the fretboard itself. One person's preference may be that the pickups don't sound as good on a 24-fret guitar, but my preference is that the guitar sounds better if I have a high E that I can play on the 24th fret, and a lot of the music I like requires 24 frets to be played. Also, the Les Paul DC with 24 frets is actually built a bit differently than a single-cutaway Les Paul; that may account for some difference as well. Like Toejam, I like a little brighter neck pickup as well.

Most people decide what they like, and proceed from there to try to "prove" the superiority of their choice. I'm sure there are classical
guitarists who feel that 18 frets is perfect and any more is anathema.

[xenophobe]

Re: 24 Frets vs 22 Frets and Picke Up Placement

What about a 25 fret guitar? [img]/images/graemlins/scratchhead.gif[/img]

[jazzman]

Re: 24 Frets vs 22 Frets and Picke Up Placement

I remember a 36 fret in the 80's. I think it was Washburn. I remember it was in a magazine ad. I can't seem to find a pic. (not quick enough for my patience anyway)

[Ace]

Re: 24 Frets vs 22 Frets and Picke Up Placement

There is less of a difference in tone between the two pickups of a 24 fret guitar as opposed to a 22 fret guitar, since the pickups are considerably closer together. As for the "harmonics", that's a load of crap, because as we all know, you get much better harmonics on your bridge pickup anyways. Neck pickups are closer to the center of the strings vibration, so they pick up more of the root tone of the string, which is bassier, and the bridge pickup gets more harmonics, which makes it brighter and easier to do artificial or "pinch" harmonics. The difference in construction between the two varies from guitar to guitar, and the added/reduced mass does as well, so they are sort of negligible. The two main differences are, first and most obvious, that you have two more frets to play on, and if you need them to play, there they are. Secondly, the slightly greater difference in tone because of the placement of the neck pickup in the string's speaking length.

[Ace]

Re: 24 Frets vs 22 Frets and Picke Up Placement

And I've seen 36 fret guitars(I think Uli Jon Roth is playing a 37 fret right now). I think Washburn did make a 36 fret, but I can't recall the name either.

And the Les Paul DC has considerably less mass than a regular Les Paul. And they're cheaper too.

[jazzman]

Re: 24 Frets vs 22 Frets and Picke Up Placement

37? Wow. And I thought the 36 fret looked fukked up.

[Razor]

Re: 24 Frets vs 22 Frets and Picke Up Placement

Wasn't the 36 fret Washburn a Steve Stevens model?